Peter Tanhthold Hansen
San Francisco de Asis; Peru's Transoceanic Highway
NPR/NGS Radio Expeditions
25 Jul 2000
- Marcapata; San Francisco de Asis
- -13.50333 -70.89472
- 14:35 - 1:23:58
- SONY TCD-D7
Stereo=1; Decoded MS stereo
NPR/NGS RADIO EXPEDITIONS
Log of DAT #: 2
Engineer: Leo Del Aguila
Date: July 2000
ng = not good
g = good
vg = very good
00:26-Leo introduces. Are in the hot springs, the Putamayo river. People getting ready to go back into the square. Marcapata, Peru
00:50-Ambience begins. Sounds of a goat? Slight fiz in the background like wind through trees. Fades out as Leo moves forward.
1:19-Voices speak, neighing animal.
1:59-ng-They're stuck. Slight chatter.
2:09-AMBI-Sound of a car engine revving, faint in the background. Grow slightly
louder. Pouring water on the right before moving off to the left.
3:11-FX-wrenching something open. Car hood?
3:21-FX voice shouts. Leo? Sound of something being worked on? Thumping noise.
4:08-FX Car engine revvs, gets louder before moving by and slowing down. (G) Then
4:34-More voices. Short.
5:03-Child-"Buenos Dias", then incoming car noise. Car approaches then idles right in
front. Sound of car engine stopping, door opens and someone steps out. Squeaking of seat?
5:34-Chatter, soft at first.
5:51-Voices get louder. English and Spanish being spoken. "Vamos a la iglesia?" More chatter. Greetings. Birds tweet in the background as car doors are shut.
7:14-VG FX-Car engine revvs up, brief voices, then car engine revvs, and move off.
7:45-FX-Second car starts. Drives by, good sound.
8:06-FX-third car starts, right as second is falling out of ear range. Comes near, idles briefly, then stops.
8:45-Approaching idle vehicle, then more car growls before starting up and moving off.
9:35-AMBI-Car noises gone, chirping of birds takes over for a few seconds while Leo walks around a bit. Louder bird chirps. Some murmuring in the background. Active piece of 'place' ambience (VG)
10:30-FX-Door shuts, car is started. Slight coughing while car idles.
11:03-Leo: Okay, second chapter of the day (car door slams)
Leo: Yeah, we're going over to the church, and we're going to interview a padre I guess. Testing levels while general activity going on in the background.
12:00-Walk into the church.
12:08-Mayor-Buenas Dias. (General greetings exchanged) More chat between the people. In Spanish at the moment.
13:06-Conversation in Spanish.
14:40-Padre (in translation): this church is one of three churches that were built almost at the same time. 1600 1640-50, but the other two churches are changed. This is the only church in Peru that has not changed until now. Every time there is a new mayor, he wants to change the roof. (laughing) Because it's most original church in all America in this way. You can see the things in here are coming down from the rain. Here, we have more rain than in other places in the world. There's only two places where there's more rain than Marcapata, in Vietnam, and another place. (laughing) So, the rain ... the water's (trailing off as they move from the microphone.)
16:11-Lull in conversation, echoey voices as they move around the church. Hard to hear. (mic noise?)
16:55-More conversation, ok but away from mic. Talking about securing the church.
17:22 Padre Peter - So, I managed to get money from Germany. I'm from Denmark, you know. And I've forgotten all my (something) Thirty years I've been here, I've been here thirty years. So you see, I (mumbles). But I understand. So from (something). The church in Germany, they helped us to secure the church, and the aqua? Van: Drainage Padre: Drainage system. It's a very nice drainage system from the Spanish time. And they have repeated that around the church. And here inside the (something) secure the opposite side.
18:32-John-The gold work. Padre: eh? John: The gold work is so beautiful. (conversation about the gold paint)
18:54-Padre-But you see, the most part of the pictures are empty all around. There was a lot of picture from colonial time, but they've been stolen in the last 20 years. Now they come inside the church and take away the thing. Other voice: Padre when was this church built? Padre: About 1641. Other voice: And if people say (name) built it? (repeats) (quick conversation on who built it? Voice asks if there's a date on the bells?)
19:53-(sound of walking toward the bells) Padre: Be careful, there's no light. (walking along in the dark) Padre: I think this could be it, but I'm not sure. No light. (conversation as a flashlight is struggled out-Listen to this)
20:36-Voice: Ano Padre: It's late I think. Voice: Looks like it just says 77 or 76.
P:76 Voice: Yes
P: We can move it.
V: I can read it, I'll try. Could be latin. Septimo, Septimorre. (struggle)
21 :07 -FX-Sound of struggling and moving the bell.
21 : 16-V : We have the cross. .. (starts trying to say the Latin on the bell)
21:35-V: that's a beautiful bell. (struggle and moving the bell further)
21:50-V: here's the ano. (talks about numbers) Cross between seven and six. Looks like last two numbers. (still struggling with bell, trying to read the numbers. Long series of light conversation in trying to decipher the bell)
23:59-(Sound of moving the bell again) V: It's cracked right here. (continue to stammer through reading the bell)
25:47-FX-Dog whimpering over the conversation.
26:30-Padre: (talking it out, starting to put the mystery together, rambling)
27:30-FX-Moves the bell again. P: (Starts to say the words. Tentative at first, then more confidently. )
28:50-Suddenly goes silent? Leo is farther from them trying to figure out what's going on with the bell, then advances toward the group.
29:30-Ambi-Bed of meshing voices as they try to figure out the bell. Occasional sound of bell movement. Other voices meshing in the church. Lots of echo in it.
30:59-Fades to nothing.
31 :01-Fades up to someone speaking Spanish. (talking about the history of the church)
32:20-Translation: This is one of the last churches in all of Peru that has an original roof of straw (thatched roof) and every five years there's a tradition to strip that roof off and replace it with a new roof. It's a job of the whole pueblo there's kind a eight little communities that makes up this district and everyone gets together, strips it right down to the madera, sorry, wood. And then puts up a new thatched roof. The alcalde, the mayor, was also saying that a few minutes ago that this is one of the original churches built in 1640. And there were three original churches in the zone (names communities). Two other communities in the area that used to have similar traditions in the area but passed. Their churches are gone.
33:13-John: I've heard that there's a legend that there's gold in the thatched roof.
33: 19-Gets an answer in spanish.
33:41-Another spanish speaker talks.
34:44-Translation: It used to be said that the ancients used to say that there were idols hidden in the roof. But about 10 years ago or two roof replacements. The governor, the (something) the community leaders said, We want to see, we want to check out the roof and see what's going on. See what's up there. They came and looked and found some little things tucked in but nothing of gold or you know (something) it sounds like a thing of myth.
35: 17-John: Do they have many visitors to this town. Outsiders like us? Translator: Foreigners? John: Foreigners, or..
35:25-Speech in spanish.
35:36-Alcalde: (answers in spanish)
37:02-Translation: He said about five years ago there used to be more frequency with people passing through the road to (somewhere) but uh, during time the road deteriorated. My guess is that more people fly now, there's better air lands. So there's less people coming through and less people staying. Recently, a company did come through, I didn't catch who he was saying but came through, there were four tourists on bikes that came by that were warmly welcomed by the town. Stayed a bit then moved on. The alcalde also mentioned, the community's desire to obviously see tourism. It represents an influx of capitol, and the classic comparison to Machu Picchu, everyone goes to MP and there's a million zones around here that are super traditional, super beautiful that the community would like people to check out.
37:53-John-Would you like a better road? (question is asked in spanish)
39:03-Translation: Simply yes, I mean it would be a great thing obviously, we've given the road, and as roads go in Peru it's decent. It's rough but it gets rougher, and it is deteriorating. For the pueblo here, for the town here, they would love to see it. With a better road there would be opportunity for opening up the mining. The resource exploitation that the community wants to see, more tourism, whatever. So yeah. You ask everyone around here 'is the road a good thing?' there might be a little bit of fear, like 'yeah well, it might be bad for the nature' but everyone wants to see a road.
39:47-John: With the money that would conceivable come in from a better road. What are some of the things that he could do to improve lives in this town? (The question is asked in Spanish)
40:30-Question is answered in spanish. (slight shuffle of clothes?)
42:52-Translation: Basically, better schools, better infrastructure, better social living standard for the community. Not just for (place) that has the benefit of the road running right through it. But also for some of the outlying communities, to build roads out to them. Because in his opinion, it's one of the only ways that someone can leave poverty by having that communication link to bring the world into them. He's also mentioned he's also very pleased and on side with the current administration, Alberto Fujimori, and his capacity as mayor, he will continue struggling, continue asking and fighting for better communication links for a better social standard of living for the community.
43:44-John: Wants to say it's a pleasure to meet. Van has question: Wonder if he fears the downside of progress that comes along with a highway that brings more people, more traffic, conceivably more crime. (question is asked in spanish)
44:38-Question is answered in spanish. (some equipment sounds in this)
46:47-Translation: first off the alcalde says that in regard to crime, that there was fear with a better road, with better transport if there would be fear in delinquency. He said no you know, up until now there's been no problem here, people are superchill, to give you an example, your car on the street, you can leave your door open, no problem. I also asked culturally, with kinda an influx of foreign ideas or outside ideas, was there fear to the cultural integrity of the area and he said no. For example, I drew the parallel back to the church. This is almost a 400-year church that still has a thatch roof, it's the only one in Peru. They obviously care very much about their intact culture. As well in with the national holiday (names it) the 20th of July that is coming up. Not only do they have all the marching and typical celebrations that you find across the board in Peru, but they also have very traditional running of the bulls, mixed with condors. Sometimes they have the fortune of having a condor visit, which is a good omen, sometimes not. But, culturally, he also feels that as mayor it's his job to keep that intact with the people, but it's very sound in this area.
48:15-Thanks back and forth. Alcalde says something more in spanish.
48:46-Asks for his complete name, it's given in spanish. (bit loud and off to the left)
49:35-Further thanks back and forth.
50:04-Leo: Okay, I'm going to record ambience. Records them organizing for the picture. Falls into quiet ambience around 50:33. Generic noise, soft voices, occasional mosquito, honking of horns in the background? Badly played instrument? Bird tweets, construction work perhaps.
52:48-Leo-stopped the ambience.
53:01-New audio. John: asking how long someone's been in the town. (question
answered in spanish)
53:17-Translation: 32 years today. John: Congratulations (laughing) Happy anniversary.
Padre: The first year was in lima, then 3-4 years in the amazons, with the tribes. In (names places) We got 50 schools, a system of education. Exclusively with the tribes. Then with the reformer (name) I came here to (name) I worked here in a small community. Name is (name) very small, only 50 families. So I'm living part of my time in Quito (John sneezes) Quito belongs to the (name) so I'm doing part of my time in Quito and part here. The last three years, most of the time here because I have a lot of other things that I'm doing a lot of projects.
54:53-John: In the time, that you've been in Peru (goes into funny coughing fit) Lemme drink some water. I just want to know if you thought this town had changed in years, and how?
55:25- Padre: (brief unintelligible chatter) When I compare with 20 years ago, it's changed a lot. It's changed a lot you see. (John starts coughing again and goes off).
55:57- Padre: most of the towns here, have no water. They church stood for protection. No plaza de armas. Finished last year, it was only marked and else, no. And they the people emigrated. They're going to (places) John: Why? Man: Partly they're looking for ajob because here the prices on the agricultural projects are very low, so you can't live with a great family, you can't live. So the young people are going to the big cities, and the young people to are going to study, because there are no possibilities here because the education is very bad because of the professors or the teachers don't have adequate salary. So all are looking for better possibilities.
57 :31-John: do people go through the mining industry and the timber industry?
57:35- Padre: Well, that's the last thing they want to do but they have to do it because they (something). Earning a lot of money, but their life is very expensive in the (something), they are coming back, many of them getting diseases. They don't like it but they're forced to do it.
58:16-John: Paolo was telling us that this is the oldest regions in Peru for gold mining, that it's been going on forever.
58:25- Padre: Yes, you find notes about it in books from the colony. Names from here are mentioned in this colonic(something). So many people come here for mining, and up in the high mountains but they don't find anything. It's just going down into the rivers and washing gold in the rivers.
59:00-John: If it's like anywhere else, there are booms from time to time the word gets out that it's here, then everyone comes and it's not here and they all leave.
59:19- Padre: Well, I think it had a future here, not a future of mining or production, you have a lot of energy, possibilities for energy here, and it could change many things. The products, local products, and industrial products. It could be a very good place for tourists, you know. But the tourists need new roads and better (something). And actually only the adventurous can come in here. (laughing)
1 :00:04-John: Only the crazy tourists. (laughs, then opens up for other questions)
1 :00:15-Another: When you came here, what condition did you find your church in? Man: Well, it was in rather bad shape because no one had done anything since the 17th century to restore or maintain the church, only the roof. The roof is a very good roof because it changes every six years. So you have a very good roof but from the ground the water came up in the walls, so all the pictures were destroyed little by little. So it was in very bad shape, I know Phillip tries to conserve the church. (something) I think it's worthwhile, this church, lots of things that are very original and very beautiful. We ask people for help, at least we could secure the church. (something)
1:01 :41-Another: And you said this church was built in the late 1600s?
1:01 :44- Padre: Yes, yes, it was 1680 or something like that. I think it was built in 50 years, the three churches. Not all built at the same time. Not sure whether it's the first or the last, we don't know.
1 :02:06-Another: And we're not sure who built it, but people say Fuyatarki?
1 :02:11- Padre: I've heard that name too. But I have no idea about that. Another: I wonder if he built the church with money he got from gold or (something) or both? Man: I think the gold prices, gold would be the best thing at that time. There were gold mines around. This was the last station before the gold people gold searchers went into the jungle. So you have, (stammers) They remember the old times when the people made the (something) of leaving feast here. You have poetry about going into the jungle and not coming back. (something) Another: That's still very common, the despacho. Man: No despacho. Another: but similar. Man: They make despachos, because it's the last state before they leave.
1 :03:39-Another: The valley below us was famous for the cocoa fields. It was called Andes de Chocoa and they were destroyed in a flood in the late I700s about 100 years after the church was built. And that probably changed a lot of things for this valley. And MP the town subsided, and the gold and the lumber down below is sort of bringing back.
1 :04:06-John: You told us a legend of popular belief that you need to keep the thatched roof because that's where all the gold was hidden. Another: Well, the people on the trek that we were just on, in (places) they were telling us that some folks wanted to change the roof of this church but others didn't because the golden idols were hidden up there and if they changed the roof they would be found and lost. But these are what people are telling us.
1:04:40- Padre: All the people here think that there's a lot of treasures in the church, so we can't touch it. But I'm sure there's nothing left. Another2: I have an unrelated question. Man: What was this district like during the (something insurgency) Man: No, here? In (something) was used by (someone) as a place to relax, and restore the forces. And therefore they didn't make actions here. There were other peoples, who I think was not (someone) and they stopped us up there. (something) But I think that it wasn't from (someone) I don't know the (something) the ideology or way to speak about the revolution.
1:05:50 - Anton Seimon: When I was here last year, a shopkeeper told me of an incident about 7 or 8 years ago where a group of horsemen rode into the town and took over the town for three days. Man: Yes, but it was done (somewhere) A2: think they were terroristas or banditos? Man: I don't know exactly, because when the soldiers came, they went away two days before, so they were informed about the soldiers and the armor that would come. They didn't make propaganda (something) Usually when they take over the town, they make all the speeches. They didn't do that. They only wanted food and so on. [music starting up in the background]
1:06:57-Van: The sort of limited prosperity that this town has enjoyed vs others off the road, when the transoceanic highway is built, it will hardly be used at all. Wondering what the effect of transoceanic highway will be. Will that impact the economy of the town?
1:07:37 Padre: it's hard to say, because they have an alternative. They go (places) They want to connect the Atlantic to the pacific, and the best way to do that is by Puno Arequipa not Cuzco. I could imagine that there would be another way around, that would be less traffic here and it could mean that we would be isolated here, more than now. But I'm not sure that it depends on the (something) I think they think of tourists here, because it belongs to Cusco and Cusco tourists have all that you can think. They have the colonial from the old times, they have the (something) they could climb in the mountains, could go and enjoy. You have all that you want for tourists.
1 :08:59-Ambience-[military march music has been steady advancing before silence listening to the music, slightly off key]
1:10:43-Fade out to essentially silence.
1:11:37 Silence ends, military march music still playing. Momentary fade out, then fade right back in. Can hear xylophone and drums.
1:15:09-Music finally fades out. Ambience-Some shuffling noises and fade in on a crowd scene? Conversations in Spanish. Sounds like they are working on something, moving objects around.
1 :16: 15-FX -Someone yelling loudly in Spanish twice.
1 :17:02-Fade to silence.
1:17:10-Leo: Okay, I'm by some waterfalls. Nothing has changed, everything is the same. He's stabilizing the level. Alright, here we go.
1 :17:30-VG AMBI-of waterfalls. Great water noises ...
1: 19: 17-Brief noise of voices in the ambi, then waterfall again. 1:21:15-Fades out to silence quickly.
1:21 :17-AMBI-Fading back up to sound of motor vehicles moving along rough road.
1:22: 16-Starts crashing through water, then revvs up and moves onward. 1 :23:07-Going over rocks? Crushing rocks?
Very active sequence!
1 :24:00-Leo: that was us moving slowly along the road. Hopefully we can use some of it. Really bumpy so he's going to see if he can use it. Fades off to silence.
1 :24:26-Fades back in. Leo: We're inside the truck, now recording from inside. Ambience starts right after. Noises of bumping and jolting along the road. More subdued but loud anyhow. Shuddering noises.
1 :26:02-Blows horn a few times.
1 :28:29-Fade out then right back in to new ambience. Sounds like outside, car moving by. Rough noises, moving through underbrush?
1:31 :40-Fades out.
1:31 :44-Fades back in on idling car. Door slams and car goes in motion. Some talk.
Driving through water?
1:33:10-Car is idling. Noise of wind? Rain? Leo: Truck going through muddy pothole.
Going to have to join them.
1 :34:52-Fades to silence.
1 :35:36-Fades back into the sound of car. John: Day 2. Things started out well enough. We ended up staying in a pretty nice lodge with a pretty nice hot springs bath that we were in for a while. Then we visited a beautiful church and talked to a priest, now we're. stuck in the mud.
1 :36:06-Cut and opens. Leo: Try day two open again.
1 :36: 14-John: Day 2, started well enough. We ended up in a nice lodge in the cloud forest. And we took a nice hot bath in the hot springs in the morning. Then we talked to a priest and visited a beautiful church built in the 1700s sometime [NOTE: Was 1600s]. Learned a lot about how people feel about roads. The mayor of this particular town wants them. And now we're stuck in the mud waiting for the third car in our three car convoy.
1 :36:52-Fade out.
1:41:00-END OF DAT!